Why B2B Marketing Got Harder (And What to Do About It)

Jordan: So in the world of e-commerce, businesses, they could potentially launch a new product, create a bit of TikTok content, or chuck up a few Meta ads, and within weeks, potentially, you can actually start to see some sales, and they start to roll in. But B2B companies, it’s a completely different thing. In a B2B company, you could spend absolutely months trying to craft that perfect email nurture sequence, or put on different events, or host a webinar or a workshop and things like that, and then you can still get crickets from it. Now, if that sounds familiar, we are starting to see this massive divide behind what is actually happening in marketing right now, especially with the AI evolution, with the divide between B2C marketing and B2B marketing.

Jordan: So that’s what we’re going to discuss on the podcast today. If we haven’t met, my name is Jordan. Welcome to For The Daring Growth Seekers podcast. And we have got Aarti back on the podcast. This is your first time back since we changed the name of the podcast.

Aarti: It is my first time back since the rebrand.

Jordan: Thank you so much for joining us again, because I know that B2B is kind of like your jam. I kind of thought it could be a really interesting discussion, because, look, this comes up a lot in the office, doesn’t it, around how difficult B2B marketing is, and how it is just this different beast. And I guess you’re in a unique perspective that, well, you can tell the story, a background in B2B, but obviously, since working here, had a little bit of B2C kind of in there. So that’s kind of where you’re kind of seeing the divide.

Aarti: Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah, like you said, Jordan, I historically worked in B2B for the past kind of 10 years. And kind of now that I’ve got some B2B clients, I’m definitely seeing that shift in the last couple of years, of kind of what’s working in B2C is a lot different to how, kind of in B2B, we’re still doing kind of the same things, but they’re not as effective.

Aarti: And so that’s kind of what I’m really interested by, is why. Obviously AI is kind of changing every single landscape across B2B and B2C, but looking at why these challenges, specifically for B2B, and what kind of things are we doing for our clients to kind of overcome that? It’s not always, and we talked about how, a couple of years ago, webinars were the big thing, but can you remember the last time you logged into a webinar?

Jordan: No. It’s kind of the tactics that we were using five years ago. And I guess we were talking about this yesterday, around that five years ago was COVID time, and it was kind of like that big evolution, and everyone kind of realised, oh, I should have been marketing in other places, not just traditional marketing, should have been online, because now I can’t open my shop or my office and things like that. But I do feel as though that we’re kind of going through that second kind of evolution now, because obviously AI is throwing a lot of challenges at marketing for B2C and B2B as well. So it kind of feels as though that the tactics, even that we were using five years ago, even those are already now outdated.

Aarti: And I think that whole, in B2C, it’s already there, around a really seamless omni-channel experience for purchasing. And now B2B, even though you’ve got, usually, a much higher product or service you’re selling, in terms of value of revenue, and in terms of life cycle, so usually it’s not just someone popping in and making that purchase. I feel like B2B life cycle of their customer has changed a lot, and where they’re wanting to buy and how they’re buying has changed a lot as well. So people are making quite large purchases online, whereas before it would usually only be in person. So I think that, yeah, B2B, in the sense of how consumers are wanting to engage and purchase, it’s kind of this weird blur of B2B and B2C. There’s this kind of blurred line there that I think is quite interesting.

Jordan: So there’s some data. According to Salesforce, they said 69% of B2B professionals reporting sales becoming more difficult. 67% of B2B marketers are using generative AI tools to try and help their process, but results aren’t translating to sales. What do you see from your side, around some of the best practice kind of tactics that we should be having a look at? Because, as you’ve just kind of said, there are some massive kind of challenges and things that we’re kind of facing, yeah?

Aarti: Totally. And I think the best, I guess, I think having that spread of offline and online, especially if we’re talking about, let’s talk about top of the funnel lead generation, for example. I think that our B2B clients, having that spread of going to conferences and events, showing face on those offline platforms, as well as having a really good digital, like LinkedIn profile, and being able to have that really nice, seamless experience. That one’s really hard to nail, but it’s also the one that people are looking for. People want to be able to seamlessly go from an event, to then talk to you on LinkedIn, to then be served an ad potentially on their Facebook.

Jordan: Do you think we’ll see a rise of that as AI changes? Because I speak a lot around Google’s AI Mode and all these AI tools that are coming out. The fact that, if you wanted to, we could upload an image of some sort of product, and say that’s our new business, and launch it overnight. It’s so quick. So do you think that we are kind of going a little bit more, that’s not really old school, but going back to some of those…

Aarti: Traditional.

Jordan: Potentially traditional. I think sometimes they’re working better.

Aarti: Yeah. I think that, yeah, if we just take email workflows, for example, that was a really massive thing, being able to segment and personalise and contextualise. And I think that people are getting quite cynical by those now. They’re kind of like, oh, they know that these emails are automated. They’re probably being AI generated, and they’re being sent to them. But it’s kind of, I don’t know, I feel like that authenticity layer is still quite hard to nail. And I feel like some of those traditional channels are more authentic in some ways.

Jordan: So which ones would you say would be worth even investigating and having a bit of a look at? You mentioned, obviously, conferences. And it does seem that conferences are getting more and more popular.

Aarti: They’ve kind of come back. I feel like people are going back to the trade shows, and actually having that engagement with the person. And that, for top of funnel kind of lead generation, and getting in front of people, can be so impactful, because you know that they are a target audience.

Jordan: Okay. So how are we then going to capture those people, though? So you’re at a trade show, you’re at a conference. How do we then get them back into our digital realm, I guess?

Aarti: Thinking about, yeah, how do we collect data at those trade shows? I mean, I feel like everyone’s collecting some sort of data. Lots of people do competitions. Other people, they’ve got their flyers. Often people have, like, the lanyards have their codes these days. Or the actual conference organisers then give you the list of people that you’ve spoken to, or whatever that is. And obviously that then, as much as you try to, can then try and build into your top of funnel, right? So that starts…

Jordan: Yeah, I agree. And it’s like, I would always be thinking around capturing first party data, as much first party. And from a trade show, I guess what we’re thinking about there is, if you’re setting up at a trade show, and we have a couple of clients that have gone to these shows, or even e-commerce clients that have gone to these trade shows, and how do we capture those email addresses? How do we filter them through to get their permission to actually send them emails in the first place, and get them in there? Being able to upload that data into a CRM like HubSpot, to then be able to remarket those people. And I guess that’s the key really, isn’t it? First party data.

Aarti: Totally. I think the other thing that is worth noting is that trade shows are typically really expensive. So for smaller companies who don’t have massive budgets, it’s actually a really massive undertaking. And being able to determine, and be able to quantify, that return on investment for them, in terms of sales or actual leads or things like that, can be quite hard.

Jordan: Yeah. Now, that just sparked another kind of challenge that we obviously face in B2B, is that the life cycle is expensive. It can also be a long time to actually even convert one of these customers.

Aarti: Oh, absolutely.

Jordan: So it’s kind of like thinking about those investments that you’re making then and there are kind of helping to build for the future, as opposed to that B2C type gratification of, oh, shit, we got four sales today. How amazing.

Aarti: Yeah, I completely agree. It’s like where people are sitting in each stage of that funnel, and who you think you can actually push through to the end of it. And I think all of this data that we’re capturing from AI helps you determine how fast people are going to be able to move through that cycle as well. So that’s quite nice, that AI is helping us capture better data on that process as well.

Jordan: And then the negatives of it. Do you feel as though that tools like AI, and this is even just a personal perspective, tools like AI and, I don’t know, let’s think some of those beasts like Amazon and things like that, it’s a pretty quick experience if you want to purchase something. So do you feel as though that, as humans, we are getting trained to expecting things so much faster? And I guess then there’s the issue with B2B, is that process can take a little bit longer, to actually put thoughtful thought into a proposal or presentation, or the way that you’re actually going to work with someone. Do you feel as though that people’s expectations are slightly different in terms of delivery?

Aarti: I actually think that, when I think back to some of the clients that I worked with in the past, around software and platforms and things like that, I’m wondering whether those sales cycles have actually shortened just naturally, because of the way that we consume everything.

Jordan: Yeah. Yeah, and that’s the challenge, because people want things, and we have everything at our fingertips.

Aarti: Exactly. And you’ve also got so much more data. So in terms of making that decision-making process, you don’t have to, like you say, get somebody in and run that proposal for you. And then the next step is information gathering. And the next step is all of those kinds of steps, I don’t know, in some ways are condensed way more with AI.

Jordan: Okay, so then if we think then about the expectations of that customer journey, is your gut telling you that people are wanting automated, fast, AI-driven experiences? Or do you think that these kind of personal experiences are going to make a bit more of a comeback, you know?

Aarti: I actually just think that there’s a balance, and I think it depends on the client and the industry, but I think there’s always going to be a need for that personal, face-to-face kind of element. But the expectations of the digital side are way higher. And I feel like B2B companies are not quite there yet, whereas B2C, I think that’s become more native, like just across the board.

Jordan: Another tactic we’ve seen with B2B, which seems to work really well, it’s a tactic we use here, and I was keen to get your thoughts on, is personal branding. So not only founder-led branding, or a CEO branding, but even sales team personal branding, and using tools like LinkedIn. What’s your thoughts on that, and how do you think that’s moving at the moment?

Aarti: Yeah, I think it’s massive, and I think it always helps shift the dial. I don’t think it’s a be-all and end-all. It’s not going to be the one thing that the company does that, if every single team member has an amazing LinkedIn profile, I don’t think that’s going to be the thing that pushes the dial with their sales. But it’s that incremental, integrated approach, and all of these little things then come together to really build and move a business forward. Do you know what I mean? So I think it’s just that full omni-channel experience of, you’ve got all of your digital platforms, you’ve got your ads that look the same, you’ve got a really nice integrated brand, all of those types of things.

Aarti: And then when people are looking at your brand, the team members and the founder, and they’re all saying different things, they have that kind of thought leadership piece. In B2B it’s quite massive as well, which I think is a nice tie-in there, in terms of being real and being trustworthy and credible.

Jordan: So, putting you on the spot, if we were going to put down, what are some of the things that we should be focusing on right now? So what are some of the tactics that we need to be thinking about right now? Well, not even tactics. Maybe the way we need to be thinking and approaching our B2B marketing now. Is there some tweaks we need to change, like expectations around the lead cost, or expectations around how long it’s going to take to actually convert that initial touch point through to actually becoming a client? What would you say would be the biggest things, that if someone was listening right now and they’re like, okay, so what do I take away? What can I do right now? Has it changed my expectations? Has it changed something with my marketing? Yeah, what would you say?

Aarti: I think that looking at the kind of user or customer lifecycle, and being able to either apply AI to make it better, faster, more interesting, or getting through to being able to add in more channels. So, for example, if you’re doing, and by channels, maybe that’s not the right word, potentially touch points. Because I think in B2B, in terms of the lifecycle, touch points are a massive thing.

Aarti: If you’re getting them with your nurture emails, and then also they’re being served an ad in the time and place that is relevant to them. And then they are browsing on LinkedIn, and they see a post from the founder, and that founder is saying something that’s really triggered something in your mind, around a problem or need that is super relevant to you. So all of those things. I think that being able to really get into the eye of the customer, and, I mean, I feel like marketing always goes back to that target audience and the ICP. And what they need is now more information, faster, and where they are. Or maybe not even more information, but they need to be served stuff in the right time on the right platform. And I think that doesn’t matter now, whether it’s across B2C and B2B.

Jordan: You’ve nailed what my key thing that I’m thinking a lot about at the moment is: target persona, target audience. It’s getting more and more important, I feel. And if we take what we’re learning from all these changes with AI and discoverability and search, even Google have said that they will use data from Gmail accounts, from Google Drive, from what videos are being watched on YouTube, from obviously their previous search history. Honestly, yeah, it’s like they know our customers better than what we do, or even probably know you better than what you do.

Jordan: So really understanding who that person is that you’re actually trying to, or that company, or that particular person within a company, who that person is. Really trying to dial down to what their particular pain points are. Because then everything else kind of falls off the back of it. It doesn’t fall into place, because you’re already targeting them at the place that they want, on their terms, and in the format that they want to consume.

Aarti: Yeah, and then it helps with your creative and your copy and some of the messaging.

Jordan: And going back to one of those first things we spoke about, which is the in-person events, the workshops, the trade shows, the conferences. Hopefully, is it even going to help with making sure that the messaging, the banners that you invest time in, and the trade stalls and everything like that, all those investments, you can actually put a bit more confidence in, because you know exactly who you’re talking to, and what type of data you’re trying to collect from those shows?

Jordan: So look, it’s a challenge, but I think it’s kind of a fun challenge as well. And as you said, I think it’s even just thinking and going back to some of those fundamentals. Because the other big key that I’ve been thinking about, that I think serves quite well with B2B, is also going back to trying to rethink some of that old school PR. And the reason I say that is because we know that ChatGPT and all those kind of large language models are a large language model, and they focus on patterns. So if we can make sure that a lot of other sources are talking about us and our business and exactly what we do, yeah, I kind of think that’s really going to help. And that’s about going to those trade shows, being referenced at those, speaking, thought leadership, that type of thing. It all kind of adds into that traditional slash digital PR campaign, which is different from the old school backlinking and linking to your website. But it’s kind of similar in the same way, you know?

Aarti: Yeah. There’s something, I think, that also being able to give things a shot, and trialling them over a period of time. I think, especially for B2B businesses, sometimes it’s like, if something’s not working, it can feel like, oh, that was just such a big investment of money. What was the point? But I think being able for businesses to be able to really try a channel, or a trade show, for example, and actually look at, give it your best, but then be able to learn from that, and then be able to do it again next time, or potentially learn and be like, this isn’t the channel for me, but use that data properly to be able to make informed decisions.

Aarti: And then also allowing trials to actually happen. I mean, there’s a whole thing about failing fast and kind of moving on to the next thing, but there is an element here of being able to give things a shot, and actually be able to learn from the data that you have, even if it’s not doing as well as you had hoped.

Jordan: Yeah. I was just going to say something similar, essentially around, as we said at the start, B2C, you could potentially get four sales a day, and great, you can make some quick changes because an ad’s not working quite right. But I think it’s us having the expectation that it is going to be a bit harder. There’s going to be some crappy sales calls you might have to jump on, there might be some leads issues that you need to focus on. But it’s about consistency, and always just kind of adjusting, and knowing that those investments that you are putting in to your marketing, it’s going to pay off over time, because it is potentially a longer sales cycle and a longer sales process to be able to get them into actually being a customer at the end of the day.

Aarti: Absolutely. I think that’s kind of one of the funnest parts in the role that I’m in, to be able to kind of work and tweak out those little bits and their whole kind of marketing strategy, to say, okay, let’s turn the dial a little bit more, let’s kind of lay off on the side. And then slowly over time, things kind of start falling into place. And it’s such an amazing feeling, to be able to do that for clients, and then also seeing that in their pipeline, or in their sales, or working with businesses so closely. It’s a really gratifying thing.

Jordan: And then the only other thing I was going to mention, which again I think about a lot, is we all know the top of funnel takes time, as we’ve just discussed. Just rely on the people that, the network that you do have, the people that you do have, the clients. If you’ve been in business for a while, the referrals, the power of a referral can be really good. With those people that trust you already, a referral is the easiest sale to get in B2B.

Jordan: I use this as an example. If I get a referral from someone, it’s a much shorter sales process and sales cycle, as opposed to literally just get an email, as we’re discussing here, from a client in a potential business that we’re hoping to work with, that we’re trying to get across the line for a longer time. And they’re having to ask much more probing questions, because they need to understand that trust and that authority and that process that we’re following. Instead of just saying, oh, actually, I’m going to refer these guys to you because they’re epic, and they just do this, just trust them and go with it, you know? So I think that’s also the other big one, is trying to just build up that trust, and build up that referral network, I think is key.

Aarti: So that networking part, I think that also ties back into kind of those workshops and conferences, and your LinkedIn profile, and who you’re connecting with, and what you’re saying. All of that helps so much, because it’s part of kind of like your networking, and will help that referral process as well.

Jordan: So not to bag B2C, but God, it can be sometimes annoying when you see some B2C content, and they’re talking about, oh, make tweaks to this ad, and you’re going to be able to make all these sales overnight, and then you’ll be able to sell the business in four months’ time and move on to your next one, you know? So not to bag those guys, because I’m sure they’re doing really well, but B2B, it’s a different game. We need to just have those expectations and be slightly different with our approach.

Jordan: And look, if you’re struggling with B2B lead generation, you want to explore trying to implement everything that we’re talking about here today as part of your strategy, obviously that’s what you do day to day, what we do here at Done By Nine as well, working through strategies, trying to piece this all together. You are more than welcome to reach out to Aarti or myself via our website, donebynine.com. There’s also heaps of other pieces of content that we share on there as well. So you’re more than welcome to dive into that. Aarti, thanks so much for joining us again.

Aarti: Thanks for having me.

Jordan: Another good chat. And yeah, really, there’s a couple of things even from there that I’m ticking over in my head right now, that I think we need to go away and just think through a little bit more, just as we adjust our strategy as well. But yeah, thanks again for joining us on another episode of For The Daring Growth Seekers podcast.

Aarti: Thank you.