How We've Built Our Business: Our Special 5-Year Anniversary Team Roundtable

Jordan: Welcome to a very special edition of our podcast today, where we’re actually doing something a little bit different, and we have got the entire team kind of sitting around a table, and we’re going to have a look at Done By Nine over the past five years. Oh, Renee has just flicked over a lot of notes. Have you spent a bit of time going through this?

Renee: Hey, I’ve been here a very long time now.

Jordan: It looked like a blank bit of paper, and then just as I started that intro, the bit of paper turned over.

Renee: We all know I am the note taker. I can’t help myself.

Jordan: So the idea here is, obviously, as a business, we’ve just ticked over that five-year mark. We’re having a bit of a celebration this week, and going over some of the things that we’ve kind of learned over the past five years. Obviously, giving a bit of a nod to the different team members that have come and gone throughout the journey of the five years. And so we thought it’s also a good opportunity to sit down with the current team, and kind of have a chat, and see where this business has all kind of taken us, some of the clients that we’ve worked with, some of the things we’ve learned, some of the stories that we can kind of share over that time. And also just how marketing’s kind of changed over that five years.

Jordan: So we’ve got all of us here in the office today. And also Flynn is dialling in from, well, he’s originally, obviously, from Christchurch, but working remotely out of the Philippines at the moment. So Flynn, thanks for jumping on. What is the time over there, actually?

Flynn: The time currently is quarter to seven in the morning.

Jordan: Okay, well, that’s okay.

Flynn: That’s okay. So it was a bit manageable. It was an early start.

Jordan: So again, thank you so much. Should we quickly just go around, just so we understand who is actually at the table here? So obviously, Jordan, the director of Done By Nine.

Aarti: I’m Aarti. I have worked for Done By Nine since June last year, and I’m probably the newest member of the team.

Renee: I’m Renee, going over to the oldest member of the team now. I think four-plus years, probably, going on.

We’re five.

Renee: I think I came in a year into the business, maybe. And I cover all things design when it comes to the business.

Jacqueline: I’m Jacqueline. I do operations for Done By Nine, but I’m also Jordan’s wife.

You’ve got the booby prize here, I think.

Jacqueline: Yeah, I’ve got the booby prize. I get the late-night conversations.

Jordan: And Flynn?

Flynn: Obviously Flynn, and I’m a remote team member. I joined in August 2022, so I’ve been going on two and a half years now, and do everything from marketing, design and client management.

Jordan: Sounds great. And what I wanted to have a look at was, firstly, just having a look at a bit of a time machine, really, and seeing, if we think about when the business first kind of started, when we started Done By Nine, we’ve kind of shared that story. And if you did want to hear the founding story, me and Jack did a podcast a couple of weeks ago, so you can just go back in the archives a couple of episodes, and you’ll be able to see that. But it was around that COVID era. So I was working in the travel industry at the time, and COVID kind of really shaked things up.

Jordan: So there have been some big changes over the past five years. So I was keen to kind of discuss around the table, and see everyone’s kind of point of views, because we all kind of had different stories if we look back five years’ time, and then how we’ve all kind of come together as a team since then. So yeah, keen to understand from everyone around what you think has been some of the biggest changes that we’ve seen over the past five years.

Renee: I’ll start, speaking of the travel industry. So I actually worked with Jordan back when he was working for that travel industry, and then I moved over to Melbourne, and came back when he started Done By Nine. And when Jordan first employed me, one of the first things he said to me, bearing in mind I come from a design background, was, there may not be much design work for you when you first start. So we came into the business thinking, marketing heads, here we go. When you look back now, and where we are here five years later, there’s a lot of design work in this business.

Jordan: I was saying before as well, back in those days, obviously you’re nice and scrappy as well. So Canva was my best friend. And you know what? It’s one of those embarrassing ones where you look back, there was like a bright orange. Remember the orange that we used?

Renee: Oh yeah. We’ve come a long way in our own branding as well, let alone the stuff that we’re doing for our clients, I think too, which is quite cool.

Jordan: I also use, I remember there was this one kind of filter I used to put over the images, where you used to colour wash yourself.

Renee: Duotone.

Jordan: Duotone. I’m sure that was in at the time, but you do look back at some of that stuff and kind of think, obviously design and colours and everything like that has changed and evolved over time as well.

Renee: Yeah, for sure. But I do remember thinking back, when I was living in Melbourne, when you first launched: oh, look at Jords’ go with his Canva. I thought the start of the business was really good.

Jordan: Well, that, to be fair. And we have you.

Renee: Well, that’s true.

Jordan: But I think it’s interesting to note as well, that is one of the big things. Obviously tools have changed a lot over the past five years as well. So even if we take Canva as an example, even back then it was still quite an old product that was quite well used, but there’s a whole heap of other type of tools that have also kind of changed and developed over the years as well. Obviously AI is that big elephant in the room as well, but trying to keep up with how it’s all changing how we market and discover different businesses as well. Even Meta, like, Aarti, I know that you and I have had constant conversations about how Meta is always changing how to do things.

Aarti: Every week. It’s an interesting one, because over that COVID period, I was kind of off and on working part-time with children, and it was, for me, kind of coming back into work, it was around the tech changes, and being current, and staying on the pulse with that side of things. That was a massive drawcard for me to stay on the pulse, because it’s really hard when you go off the tools to then swing back into them. And Meta is a great example of that. Before I went on mat leave, it was a completely different platform and base than it is now. And now every week there’s a new feature, the buttons change, something else is different. And you’re constantly having to keep up with the changes that these platforms are making.

Aarti: So I reckon, yeah, that side is massive, and it really tests your brain and the capacity that you have. As you get older, you get really content and complacent, and things that are easy. And yeah, I feel like that is constantly pushing you to make sure that you’re staying on the pulse, and keeping up with kind of those key changes and trends.

Jordan: Another part, which I think Renee has seen the most around those changes in the last five years, especially with COVID, is around that kind of front-facing presence, and COVID with websites, and how businesses have had to change because of the COVID era, I think. And I think you’d probably have a great insight into things in terms of design and websites. What was your kind of key things, in terms of work and clients, of what they needed over that time?

Renee: Well, over that time, right, we saw the need for everyone to go online, like you say. And so it was a real saturated market. Everyone was doing it. And so how did you stand out? What was that kind of defining thing that helped you stand out against the crowd? And a lot of the time, your user experience and your design is that thing in that early stage. We’ve kind of now gone further than that. And a lot of it is that messaging. Are you kind of authentic? Are you your true self as well? And how that all works together, so that that person says, okay, cool, I choose you. I want to buy your product, or I want to use your service. I think that over the time, at the start, it was always, okay, how good do you look? But now it’s, okay, how good do you look, and how true are you being?

How do you make your user feel, your customer feel?

Renee: Exactly. How do you relieve those anxieties that we all have? Because in this AI-driven world, what is real? So, are you being authentic to yourself? Is your brand messaging aligning with who you are? And are you giving kind of authority in your space? Are you giving trust in your space? So it all kind of works together, as opposed to when I first started, I was like, cool, that looks great, that’s going to be a great product. As opposed to, okay, that looks great, what’s the message behind it? What’s the why behind that product?

Renee: And people want to see behind the scenes a bit more. They want to get into the minds of the people that are making these products or delivering these services. They want the diaries of the CEO, that content of how the product is made, all that stuff that is actually behind sometimes that pretty design, and want it to be broken down in a more engaging format, really.

Jordan: So really what we’re saying is that it’s bloody hard, and it’s not getting easier?

Renee: Yeah, I think so. And that’s the beauty of it, I think, is that it’s always going to change. There’s never going to be a set and forget for marketing, especially as we know AI and ChatGPT and all of these different bits are always going to help us, but also change the landscape for us constantly.

Jordan: Definitely. And then, just as you’re chatting today, even around the Meta changes, is something that I’ve been doing a lot of looking into, because there’s a lot of chat around agencies, and in that space, around the fact that Meta is very close (this is not confirmed, this is just me talking), Meta is very close to pulling targeting away from us, to literally go to their, what they call Advantage+, which is essentially AI-driven targeting. So using first-party data, so all the data that we collect, our email addresses and stuff like that from your customers, that’s the focus.

Jordan: And then it goes back to what you said before, Renee, around that’s when the creative thing comes back into play, because then the only way that you can differentiate your product and tell Meta who to send these ads to is going to be based on what the hell your actual creative is going to be. So again, that’s just a massive change, yeah?

Renee: And then we’re battling with things like how now ChatGPT can generate your images based on just a photo. And we’re dealing with Adobe, who you can generate images just by searching up what you want.

Jordan: But that’s a good problem, I reckon.

Renee: Oh, 100%. Because I think that will then help us differentiate what a true business versus a business that’s just faking it.

Jordan: And that’s why I was thinking about this a lot last week, around the opportunity being, now there’s a way for us to try and think about how do we convey that trust, and that real good journey with a customer. Even as an example, last week we were dealing with a new company, Jack and I, and on reflection, after dealing with this new company, I kind of thought that there were so many missed opportunities with the brand building, once we kind of reached out and did that first piece of contact with that company.

Jordan: There were so many opportunities for them to get back in our inbox, or to introduce us to this new idea, but instead it was just, then we waited 10 days, and then we got a calendar invite, and we met, and then they gave us this bit of paper, and I was kind of like, there’s so many cool ways to actually enhance that customer experience a lot. So I think that’s going to be really important to go alongside it, so you can actually make it seem more real, I guess, you know.

It’s in the opportunities and the challenges that are going to change, right?

Jordan: Yeah, definitely. Part of it is evolving.

So I do have a question for you all then. And part of all of this is, what do you do when clients come to you and say, this is my image, I want it to go viral, how do I make it go viral?

Jordan: That is always the loaded question that I… Do you know what I think about the word… And this is one of those funny questions that clients have asked in the past, and it’s a little bit frustrating, but I honestly don’t think that going viral is all it’s cracked up to be. I think what you should be aiming for, this is my point of view, is you should be trying to reach your small audience and really connect with those people, as opposed to reach millions of people, because we’re not all Coca-Colas. We’re not a massive brand with a massive budget that talks to a whole heap of people. We’re businesses in niches that have a real distinct audience.

Jordan: So going viral, I would just be then thinking about, okay, what is the definition of viral? Is it being seen by millions of people, or is it getting engagement by a small group of 2,000 key businesses that you need to target? I don’t know. What do you think?

Aarti: Yeah, I think I completely agree. I think nailing your niche is, for me, where I would kind of push all of my clients, in terms of the quality of that. If something goes viral, that’s great. But how many of those eyeballs are buying, or are relevant in terms of your actual target audience? So yeah, I’m often a little bit dubious about super viral content. Obviously, I consume a lot of it. I love it. And it is an exciting thing, but it’s very hard to get. And also, once that kind of viral phase is over, if that viral trend isn’t exactly nailing what you wanted it to say, you’re screwed. It’s really hard to then re-perceive yourself.

Aarti: So yeah, we’ve seen a lot of different viral trends kind of go wrong. And also, yeah, I feel like maybe that’s a bit of a negative spin on it. I think there’s definitely a place for viral content, but I do think that nailing your niche is probably where I would push most of my clients, because it’s about the quality of the people that you’re trying to target.

Jordan: I agree. And I guess that has been kind of some of those, I guess even that kind of rounds out a good kind of big changes that we’ve kind of seen. Obviously, the COVID era has been a big one. The way that people consume content is obviously changing a lot. Video content now still appears to be driving a lot of good success for businesses. So that’s probably another massive change. And then obviously the way that AI is kind of disrupting things as well is another massive change.

Jordan: The other thing I wanted to look at today is obviously as a business. So we kind of started with the humble beginnings of, I don’t know, just picking up a few clients in those early days, in kind of like a freelance position, which was great. Which, actually reflecting on how we kind of got some of those original clients, was based on a mix of personal branding. I started going out onto LinkedIn and trying to share a few personal stories. And actually some of the personal stuff has always done much better for me than always just focusing on educational content. But I think mixing those content pillars was also really key. And then actually just being able to hustle and get invited onto webinars back in those COVID days was a big changer for us. And obviously webinars had that massive boom around that time as well.

It made me laugh. I was just thinking, oh my God, that COVID period, webinars were everything. Everybody was doing webinars all the time. I haven’t signed into a webinar in years.

Jordan: Exactly. But at the time it bloody worked, and we got a lot of our clients that we still work with today that is based off webinars, and based on being seen in different parts like that. So yeah, really wanted to, I don’t know, give a bit of a nod to some of those early clients that we have kind of worked with. And I’m sure we’ve got a few stories that we can kind of share. Renee, obviously you’ve been working with, I don’t even know if we could count how many actual businesses we’ve kind of worked with, and helped support with, even the design side and their marketing side. But I think…

Renee: We must do it one day. We must actually count and figure it out.

Jordan: At one time, once we added up the amount of people that had signed up to one of our webinars back in the day, or gone to one of our events, or that we’ve actually worked on one-on-one, or mentored, or coached, or did the strategies for, it got up to about the 135 mark at one stage. So we must be far surpassed that, but… What are some core kind of client memories you’ve got?

Renee: I think also, just a side note to that, is giving a nod to how awesome it is that we’re still working with some of those clients from the early, early days. I know that you spoke briefly about Nick Carey from Green Meadows in the previous episode, but also the likes of the girls over at Your Real Estate. That was a really interesting start to their kind of business, but we’ve now been with them the whole time I’ve been at Done By Nine, I’d say. So that’s a real cool one. And the likes of Simple Separation, and a few other clients like that, who have still been with us. And we talk about growth and the challenges and things, as we were talking about just before, but to have clients like that, who go through all those challenges with you, and let you figure them out with them, and let you grow with them, is an awesome kind of opportunity to have.

Renee: My favourite too is, I just have such a good relationship with the girls from Your Real Estate. I can call them up whenever, and we start talking about Lara’s new pool that she’s put in, or, like, those clients that you end up forming that kind of family relationship with. But they were a cool one. We started off with them, oh, we must have been on a discovery call with them, Jords. I think we were trying to figure out…

Jordan: You named the business on the call.

Renee: On the call. It was a bizarre, but also amazing moment. We were kind of spitballing ideas, and they were just figuring out as a business where they wanted to go, what they wanted to do, what they were all about. And they just were stuck on the name of the business, and what we could call them, or what they wanted to call themselves. And I remember kind of saying, okay, so what are your values? What are you all about? What makes you different? And we were just kind of chatting. And then I kind of went quiet for a moment. And I was a little bit nervous to say it, because it was early days, and I was kind of just entering the world of branding within Done By Nine as a business. And so I wasn’t quite sure if I wanted to put it out there, but I thought, we’ll just give it a crack.

Renee: So I said to them, what about Your Real Estate? And the whole call just went quiet, and everyone was like, well, that’s it. And it was the funniest moment, because it just seemed so simple and so easy. And when you look back at the story now, you think, oh yeah, whatever, Your Real Estate. But in that moment, it was like everything clicked, and everyone on the call was just like, yep, that’s it. And I think that’s a cool example of, like, really clear on their values, what they wanted to do, what they wanted to achieve, sitting around in a room and brainstorming. And then once you put all those pieces together, it just kind of fit, and just kind of worked.

Jordan: And I find those moments are the most satisfying and fun moments with clients, is when you have that kind of feeling together that you’ve nailed something, right? You kind of both, you get that little spark in you, or you see the spark in the client’s eye, and you’re like, yep, we’re happy with that. What, do you also personally get a bit of a buzz if you go to a supermarket and see a product that you designed on the shelves? I still get a little bit of a buzz when I see it, and I didn’t even do the bloody design, but it’s still cool, because it’s going, oh, that went for us. That’s cool.

Renee: So the amount of photos that I have of Nick, my partner, with thumbs up next to my products in supermarkets is slightly embarrassing. So we were on a holiday, we were getting away for a weekend. I think it was in Taupō, and we had gone to a supermarket there, and I hadn’t seen this product in a supermarket in New Plymouth yet. And so it was the first time I’d seen it on the shelves. And so yeah, that was quite a momentous moment for me, definitely.

Jordan: Yeah, I reckon it’s pretty cool. It’s a massive milestone to kind of be able to have the opportunity to work on products like that, that are doing really well. And like you say, that particular product we’ve been working with for years and years, been through ups and downs, but we’ve kind of been on that whole journey with them, to the point where they’re actually starting to get a really good amount through supermarket sales, you know?

Renee: Yeah, for sure. And I think one big milestone with them too, so we’re speaking of Green Meadows here, obviously, was, Jordan and I, and Juliet, their marketing manager, will also attest to this, is we were dealing with quite an old website at the time. And it was one of our huge goals to get them onto a Shopify website. I think it was years in the making to get them there. And Aarti had come on board at the crucial moment that this was finally happening, that we were finally moving them to Shopify. So she was baptism by fire into Shopify.

Aarti: They’ve been an amazing client to get to know. But also, as you said, we’ve got such a historical relationship with them, like between Nick and Juliet, and Jords and you, Renee. There’s just a lot of trust. And I think the foundations that you guys built made that a really amazing client to kind of take on. And the trust that we’ve built together with them means that they’re really interested and happy to experiment with new budgets and new channels. And for me, that’s been a really fun kind of learning. And they’re in a really exciting growth kind of trajectory at the moment.

Aarti: So yeah, I completely agree that I think the foundations of that, and the fact that they are kind of a legacy client for us, we’ve kind of grown with them, and they’re a really great example of a brand and a business that we’ve grown with, and you can kind of see that growth together between Done By Nine and Green Meadows. And yeah, we’ve got so much cool stuff in the pipe for them, and I’m really excited for what’s to come.

Jordan: Any other big, I know you haven’t been on the team for as long as what Renee and Flynn have, for example, but any other big client moments for you, Aarti, that you’re pretty proud of?

Aarti: So most recently with New Plymouth Airport, with their solar farm, I feel like that, alongside with the airport stories website that Renee built and designed, that was a huge kind of moment, where I think, for them as a business, there’s so many different pieces and parts moving, and kind of to have something come together. I kind of was pulled in, and again, Renee does this groundwork, and then I’ve kind of come in and been able to see and kind of manage a launch of it. But that was an amazing one, and you can see the solar farm as you drive into the airport, and it’s amazing. Their whole kind of sustainability journey is incredible, and that’s really something that I’m really excited to be working on, and to share when we can, which is kind of in the pipes, for some kind of bigger plans for them, which is really awesome.

Jordan: And just also with how kind of daring those type of businesses are, they’re really willing to take a punt on their messaging, and really be bold, yeah?

Aarti: Oh, absolutely. And I think it’s so fun, because they’re such pie-in-the-sky, beautiful, amazing projects. So being able to be kind of part of that story, and build out these incredible websites and messaging, I think, yeah, it’s really fun. They’re a great, amazing client to work with us, so we have a great relationship with them. And yeah, I think that’s a really exciting one that, again, it’s in the pipe, but some cool stuff happening this year.

Aarti: Another one that we’ve been working with is Red Jacket, engineering firm in Taranaki. They’re a really great client to kind of see, clients that don’t have any marketing, and then kind of are looking at you to be like, well, what can we do? It’s kind of that blank canvas of, cool, let’s come up with some ideas. And yeah, me and Renee have had a lot of fun kind of working together to build something amazing for these guys. And again, I think that this year is going to be, yeah, a huge one for them.

Renee: Yeah, for sure. And it’s that space too that’s really exciting. I know we talk about these bigger clients, but these, and I don’t want to call them smaller clients, but these clients that are looking to grow, these clients that are looking to elevate themselves, and that they’re on that really fun verge of really breaking through and having massive growth, or their client, they’ve got a lot more clients, and they’re looking to kind of elevate themselves in a way that they can service those clients a lot more. That’s a really fun space for us to work in as well. So how can we take this brand and elevate it in a way that brings them into that space, that kind of takes them that one step further?

Renee: I think that we are lucky to work with a lot of those businesses. Jordan and I launched a website for one of them yesterday, who were looking to bring themselves into a higher level. They wanted to elevate their brand. They wanted to service more clients in a wider area. And so we had the opportunity to help them do that. So there’s a lot of cool kind of success stories in that space as well, where, like you say, some of them are starting from scratch. They don’t have much marketing. How can we then take them to that next level?

Jordan: Nice. Flynn, what client project are you most proud of, if you look back?

Flynn: I don’t know if I have a really pinnacle moment, but in terms of clients, I’m really enjoying both PCRN and SkinAware. And for me, these organisations are quite different, well, you can look at the scale, but similar in a lot of regards, where the work that I’m doing and the work that they’re doing directly helps people. So any of that marketing that I’m doing, that work that I’m doing, has real impact. So if we can help support them, the more people that they can help. So SkinAware, with their checks, their awareness that they’re bringing to a lot of people across New Zealand, and then PCRN, with their different clinical trials to bring new medications, to bring new technology in, that can really, really help people down the line. So I think that’s what’s really memorable for me, working with these kind of clients that can actually directly help people. That kind of gets me going.

Jordan: That’s so funny as well. And what a cool opportunity, I guess, for us to all suddenly become clinical trial experts. Who would have thought that there was a company like that that really needed help with their marketing, that we were able to come in and actually help build out their strategy in those early days, when they were kind of merging all these different clinical trial sites from across New Zealand. And yeah, then you learn about this industry that is having, like you say, Flynn, a massive impact on so many people. And yeah, it’s quite cool to kind of have that opportunity to kind of have that front-row seat.

Especially when you learn how to spell some of these medical terms, or even appropriate name, because you’ve learned so much about it. I can’t remember what one it was. Is it coeliac? There’s something that’s spelled very wrong.

C-O-E, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then Americans spell it different. Then they had an American on the team, and oh, it just turned, yeah.

Jordan: And reflection on all of those stories, there’s a whole heap of other client stories, but I actually did a post the other day on LinkedIn as well, just around how it is kind of a privilege. We do sit in a really cool position with the business that we’ve got here, that we do get to sit in the front-row seat for all of these type of organisations. Even the examples that we’ve shown here. I did a post the other day about working with another one of our legacy clients, which is Simple Separation. So they, again, are helping thousands of Australians divorce amicably, and without the high legal fees and things like that.

Jordan: Being able to sit in that front-row seat and kind of watch all these organisations kind of grow. They’ve all got real cool purpose behind them. They’ve all got really cool goals behind them. They’re all helping so many different sectors. You can pinpoint all these businesses where they’re trying to help, where they’re trying to put the energy. And I think that’s kind of a cool position for us to kind of sit in, and learn from, and see all these really inspiring people, and how they work too, you know?

Jordan: The other big thing is, obviously, over that time, the privilege of kind of seeing all these businesses, how they’ve grown. Obviously we’ve changed, developed over time as well. One of the big key things that we’ve been focusing on has been even our internal values, hence why we’ve even got, well, we’ve got new cups coming.

Oh, beer coolers.

Jordan: We do have new beer coolers, with For The Daring Growth Seekers on it. So obviously there’s been massive changes for us as a team to kind of go through and figure out our core values as well.

Jacqueline: Well, there’s been a bit of a change, I think, and a bit of a journey. Our core values aren’t just words that we’re going to put on a poster. It’s essentially our DNA. It’s our company culture. It’s how we generally connect with our clients, and how we evolve over time. We’ve been down the road where, a few years ago, we had what? Maybe, who did a count? Maybe we got to 16 values. They all had meaning, but they were very hard to live by on a daily, because there were so many.

Jacqueline: So I think the journey has been coming together as a team, and evolving that, and simplifying it down to, what are our three core values that we can live by day in, day out, and pull that back into our client work, and aspire them to get what they want, and listen to what they have been heard. So that is where one of our core values come from, which is the Daring Growth Seekers, to help our clients go beyond, and to reach their goals, and go on that journey with them. Which is kind of cool.

Jordan: And I guess when we decided on that as one of the core values, even just the stories that we’ve just shared there around a handful of the clients, they all kind of fit that persona as well, that all of them have kind of got a real cool purpose behind them, and they’re all seeking growth, they’re all seeking how can we do better, and continue to evolve over time, yeah?

Jacqueline: Yeah, I think it’s understanding their needs, and the longer we go on that journey with them, we get a deeper level of understanding, and we get to go on the journey with them, and the rewards as they win, right?

Jordan: And then, as we said at the start, marketing is changing, design is changing, so that second value, around being inspiringly curious, is obviously a big one as well, yeah? So trying to always be at the forefront of learning, and even go around the education piece, and always trying to learn, and understanding that times are changing, and that there’s actually really cool opportunities that come out of it. So that was the drive behind that one, and then that first one as well.

Jacqueline: Yeah, so passionately dedicated is the passion that we put in with the clients, and being there for them, being their sounding board, putting the ideas together, putting the strategies together, and linking it all together.

Jordan: So yeah, that’s where we’re moving, alongside all those cool client stories that we’ve kind of got. And I thought we could kind of wrap up today’s episode as well, because I think that was really inspiring, just with some of the stories, some of the things that we’ve kind of been able to do. We’ve spoken a lot about the past five years, so where to, even over the next, I don’t know, even five months, with the way that speed is kind of going at the moment? What are we thinking is happening over the next year or two? Flynn, what would be your kind of big prediction, things that businesses should be thinking about?

Flynn: Yeah, well, I think with so much changing, it’s going to be pretty important to keep that genuineness, that human side, not just being a polished, oiled machine. That authenticity is going to win over perfection, and people are going to continue to connect with people. So that’s my sort of take.

Yeah, I think based on the conversations that we’ve had today too, about the changing, and how everything’s ever changing, I think stay agile. So stay agile, keep evolving with the times, but also keep evolving with your business. So we’ve spoken about the fact that we’ve grown as a business, the fact that we’ve continued to look at our values and what we stand for as a business. You need to keep doing that as well, alongside your marketing efforts. So as Flynn said, people are craving that authenticity, people are craving that real you. So looking inside the business and saying, okay, cool, what are our values? What is our messaging? Is that aligning with that? And are we evolving with the times, within our business and within our marketing efforts?

Jordan: And I think that, yeah, I like that sentiment that Flynn had around people. And I think with everything being so AI-driven, taking things back down to a round table in your office, or asking the shop floor staff, that type of thing, I think, has a lot of genuine value that ChatGPT is not going to give you. So I think that people-driven, people-first type of element, I think should always, that clients and us, we should always try and keep that, and hold on to it. And then on top of that, my big one would be that technology is awesome as well, and it is pretty impressive, what it can actually do. So it’s about, okay, how can you…

Jordan: How do we use it? And how can we see it as an opportunity? The thing that scares me about technology is there’s just so much opportunity. It’s about, we’re just going to get lost. And we’re going to be like, oh, you’re going to get left behind, because it’s us moving so fast. So that’s one of my big goals as well, is just trying to keep up, and test and enjoy it, and say, okay, how is everything kind of changing? How can you actually use it to make your business better?

I think that’s where an organisation or business’s strategy is going to remain really, really important. Having those core pillars, to the likes of your brand and how you want to be seen. The technology that we can use, and the tools we can lean on, are going to be constantly changing, and we can keep exploring how we can optimise and utilise different tools to achieve your goals. But I think keeping that core pillar, the core reasons for doing what you do, how you operate, need to be kept to a high regard, kept to a high standard, and utilised more. I think that’s something that you don’t want to lose or forget.

Jordan: Nice. I appreciate it. And thank you so much for your time. We’ve now taken 40 minutes out of everyone’s work day to come here. It’s been kind of nice just to sit around the table and chat, but I know that everyone’s inboxes are probably piling up. There’s heaps of work that needs to be done, heaps of cool opportunities out there.

Jordan: Jack and I kind of appreciate the team, not only the team members that are sitting with us here today around the table, but also the team that we’ve had the privilege of working with, that have gone on to have babies and currently on maternity leave, some that have gone off travelling, that have just gone off to do other things in business as well. It has been a massive privilege to work with all of those people. And obviously, as we’ve said here, all the clients that have trusted us to work with them on their businesses. And there have been so many that we haven’t mentioned here today, across both Australia and New Zealand. A whole heap of different sizes and industries and people and skills.

Jordan: Yeah, it’s really cool to watch all those inspiring businesses, and those business owners, and the entrepreneurs that we work with, the marketing teams and the marketing leaders that we get to work alongside, and help inject our skills within their teams. All these people that we get to mirror and learn from on a daily basis. It really is a massive privilege to do what we do, and here’s to the next five years.